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> Government defeated in pubs vote, publicans to get a fairer deal, hopefully...
3mm
post Nov 20 2014, 02:38 PM
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The government has been defeated in a Commons vote on the control that parent companies can exercise over pubs. BBC News

Details of the proposals are here: Publicans to get a fairer deal ...... CAMRA's reaction: CAMRA press release ...... HANSARD coverage of the debate.

Aren't the Conservatives supposed to believe in competition, an open market and entrepreneurship? Why on earth would they support pubcos who force landlords to buy beer from them at vastly inflated prices instead of allowing them to go to the open market? Well done the opposition for defeating the government on this one guiness.gif


Votes cast by local MPs:
Andrew Miller (Ellesmere Port/Neston, Lab) - voted Yes
Ian Lucas (Wrexham, Lab) - voted Yes
Mark Tami (Alyn/Deeside, Lab) - voted Yes
Stephen O'Brien (Eddisbury, Con) - voted No
Stephen Moseley (Chester, Con) - no vote registered

Overall result: 284 Yes, 269 No.


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Mr W
post Nov 20 2014, 06:15 PM
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QUOTE (3mm @ Nov 20 2014, 02:38 PM) *
The government has been defeated in a Commons vote on the control that parent companies can exercise over pubs. BBC News

Details of the proposals are here: Publicans to get a fairer deal ...... CAMRA's reaction: CAMRA press release ...... HANSARD coverage of the debate.

Aren't the Conservatives supposed to believe in competition, an open market and entrepreneurship? Why on earth would they support pubcos who force landlords to buy beer from them at vastly inflated prices instead of allowing them to go to the open market? Well done the opposition for defeating the government on this one guiness.gif


Votes cast by local MPs:
Andrew Miller (Ellesmere Port/Neston, Lab) - voted Yes
Ian Lucas (Wrexham, Lab) - voted Yes
Mark Tami (Alyn/Deeside, Lab) - voted Yes
Stephen O'Brien (Eddisbury, Con) - voted No
Stephen Moseley (Chester, Con) - no vote registered

Overall result: 284 Yes, 269 No.


Wrexham MP Ian Lucas will be at the CAMRA branch meeting this evening at the Griffin in Gresford for a Q&A session so that should be very interesting.

Despite being name a "beer champion" by CAMRA HQ, Chester MP Stephen Mosely has never backed any of our requests for helping publicans. As you see he did not vote, but then a couple of weeks ago he was singing the praises of the pubcos when attending the Punch Taverns roadshow



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Marty Funkhouser
post Nov 20 2014, 07:20 PM
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QUOTE (Mr W @ Nov 20 2014, 06:15 PM) *
QUOTE (3mm @ Nov 20 2014, 02:38 PM) *
The government has been defeated in a Commons vote on the control that parent companies can exercise over pubs. BBC News

Details of the proposals are here: Publicans to get a fairer deal ...... CAMRA's reaction: CAMRA press release ...... HANSARD coverage of the debate.

Aren't the Conservatives supposed to believe in competition, an open market and entrepreneurship? Why on earth would they support pubcos who force landlords to buy beer from them at vastly inflated prices instead of allowing them to go to the open market? Well done the opposition for defeating the government on this one guiness.gif


Votes cast by local MPs:
Andrew Miller (Ellesmere Port/Neston, Lab) - voted Yes
Ian Lucas (Wrexham, Lab) - voted Yes
Mark Tami (Alyn/Deeside, Lab) - voted Yes
Stephen O'Brien (Eddisbury, Con) - voted No
Stephen Moseley (Chester, Con) - no vote registered

Overall result: 284 Yes, 269 No.


Wrexham MP Ian Lucas will be at the CAMRA branch meeting this evening at the Griffin in Gresford for a Q&A session so that should be very interesting.

Despite being name a "beer champion" by CAMRA HQ, Chester MP Stephen Mosely has never backed any of our requests for helping publicans. As you see he did not vote, but then a couple of weeks ago he was singing the praises of the pubcos when attending the Punch Taverns roadshow

No surprise about Mosley, the guy is a complete waste of space and incapable of an independent thought.


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captain duff
post Nov 21 2014, 11:51 AM
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There's no support for me for Mr Mosely, but in relation to the MP 'beer champions' in fairness that related to the successful campaign last year run jointly by the pub companies, the brewers and CAMRA over cutting beer duty - http://www.beerandpub.com/news/top-mps-hon...d-in-parliament

Obviously over the beer tie issue the pub companies (who dominate the BBPA) takes the opposite position to CAMRA, and it probably isn't surprising that Mosely would favour the large companies over the consumers on this one.



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iandyChesterCity
post Nov 21 2014, 01:33 PM
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This Government is indeed a very odd conservative government.

Free market ideas seem to have been superceded by a will to control markets, which goes against everything i thought a conservative stood for. This isn't just in this example, we are seeing it in legal services too. A drive to create mega-firms and have accreditations refusing to let the market dictate.


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Marty Funkhouser
post Nov 21 2014, 02:57 PM
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QUOTE (iandyChesterCity @ Nov 21 2014, 01:33 PM) *
This Government is indeed a very odd conservative government.

Free market ideas seem to have been superceded by a will to control markets, which goes against everything i thought a conservative stood for. This isn't just in this example, we are seeing it in legal services too. A drive to create mega-firms and have accreditations refusing to let the market dictate.

The last thing the Conservative Party wants is a 'free market'; they are corporate-capitalists looking after the vested interests of the oligarchs and mega-corporations who bankroll them.


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3mm
post Nov 22 2014, 11:15 AM
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Greg Mulholland quoted from Hansard. Here's your pub champion! bowdown.gif

"Let us look at the reality of what the big pubcos have done to skew the traditional tied tenancy model. Punch Taverns, a pub company that does not brew a single pint of beer, made a profit over 10 years—these are its figures from its own annual report—of £2.271 billion, all from on-selling beer to its own so-called business partners. Frankly, in any other country, that would be called a protection racket. It is extraordinary and unjustified, which is why it is right for us to try to deal with it."


The pubco model is what the Conservatives were supporting. It's disgraceful angry.gif


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shunter blue
post Nov 27 2014, 12:26 PM
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QUOTE (3mm @ Nov 20 2014, 02:38 PM) *
The government has been defeated in a Commons vote on the control that parent companies can exercise over pubs. BBC News

Details of the proposals are here: Publicans to get a fairer deal ...... CAMRA's reaction: CAMRA press release ...... HANSARD coverage of the debate.

Aren't the Conservatives supposed to believe in competition, an open market and entrepreneurship? Why on earth would they support pubcos who force landlords to buy beer from them at vastly inflated prices instead of allowing them to go to the open market? Well done the opposition for defeating the government on this one guiness.gif


Votes cast by local MPs:
Andrew Miller (Ellesmere Port/Neston, Lab) - voted Yes
Ian Lucas (Wrexham, Lab) - voted Yes
Mark Tami (Alyn/Deeside, Lab) - voted Yes
Stephen O'Brien (Eddisbury, Con) - voted No
Stephen Moseley (Chester, Con) - no vote registered

Overall result: 284 Yes, 269 No.

Judging by some of your posts on here I can see that you've got the Tories sussed out. It's a pity NFBT is so blind. Horrible party. I always vote, but I'm struggling this time round to vote Labour (over Milliband holding the S*n) but I probably will.
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Neil Fishers Big...
post Nov 27 2014, 02:48 PM
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QUOTE (shunter blue @ Nov 27 2014, 12:26 PM) *
QUOTE (3mm @ Nov 20 2014, 02:38 PM) *
The government has been defeated in a Commons vote on the control that parent companies can exercise over pubs. BBC News

Details of the proposals are here: Publicans to get a fairer deal ...... CAMRA's reaction: CAMRA press release ...... HANSARD coverage of the debate.

Aren't the Conservatives supposed to believe in competition, an open market and entrepreneurship? Why on earth would they support pubcos who force landlords to buy beer from them at vastly inflated prices instead of allowing them to go to the open market? Well done the opposition for defeating the government on this one guiness.gif


Votes cast by local MPs:
Andrew Miller (Ellesmere Port/Neston, Lab) - voted Yes
Ian Lucas (Wrexham, Lab) - voted Yes
Mark Tami (Alyn/Deeside, Lab) - voted Yes
Stephen O'Brien (Eddisbury, Con) - voted No
Stephen Moseley (Chester, Con) - no vote registered

Overall result: 284 Yes, 269 No.

Judging by some of your posts on here I can see that you've got the Tories sussed out. It's a pity NFBT is so blind. Horrible party. I always vote, but I'm struggling this time round to vote Labour (over Milliband holding the S*n) but I probably will.

I assume you mean me SB?
First of all SB of course you are going to get approval of left wing" posts,history shows that DC has overwhelmingly left wing posters,and I have no problem with that.
We all have our reasons for voting for who we do,Im certainly not blind! I understand yours,there are many reasons I would never vote Labour,I'm not going to start a debate on here on that,suffice to say,at the moment we have a shadow secretary speaking out about private schooling,and where was he educated? Private school of course,this seems to be a theme that continually runs through the history of the Labour Party,hypocrisy,"don't do what I do,do what I say"
As you say yourself,you are even struggling yourself to decide to vote for Millibland,but of course you will,we even had a Champaign Socialist MP sneering at one of the "so called working class" the other day,that the Labour Party are supposed to represent,so I understand that it may be difficult for to recognise the Party as you once knew it,now we have former PM Multi-millionaire Blair telling Millibland not to pull the party too much to the "left" and to take the middle ground.
If I'm allowed to offer an opinion,the party certainly chose the wrong Millibland brother,and it's a relief that Alan Johnson has not decided to put himself forward as contender for the leadership,David Millibland or Alan Johnson would be way ahead in the polls at the moment,as the present government has had to take some every unpleasant decisions to correct our economy which doesn't go down well with all voters,but let's wait until May and see what happens.


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Midnight Rider
post Nov 27 2014, 02:55 PM
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QUOTE (3mm @ Nov 22 2014, 11:15 AM) *
Greg Mulholland quoted from Hansard. Here's your pub champion! bowdown.gif

"Let us look at the reality of what the big pubcos have done to skew the traditional tied tenancy model. Punch Taverns, a pub company that does not brew a single pint of beer, made a profit over 10 years—these are its figures from its own annual report—of £2.271 billion, all from on-selling beer to its own so-called business partners. Frankly, in any other country, that would be called a protection racket. It is extraordinary and unjustified, which is why it is right for us to try to deal with it."


The pubco model is what the Conservatives were supporting. It's disgraceful angry.gif


You really are selective. Punch Taverns, the company you've rallied against, come into being in 1997, the year Tony Blair became Prime Minister. There was then 13 years of Labour government who did absolutely nothing about it. And Greg Mulholland that you're praising - he's a Lib Dem! He's only an MP at all because he took the seat from Labour!



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3mm
post Nov 27 2014, 06:18 PM
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QUOTE (Midnight Rider @ Nov 27 2014, 02:55 PM) *
QUOTE (3mm @ Nov 22 2014, 11:15 AM) *
Greg Mulholland quoted from Hansard. Here's your pub champion! bowdown.gif

"Let us look at the reality of what the big pubcos have done to skew the traditional tied tenancy model. Punch Taverns, a pub company that does not brew a single pint of beer, made a profit over 10 years—these are its figures from its own annual report—of £2.271 billion, all from on-selling beer to its own so-called business partners. Frankly, in any other country, that would be called a protection racket. It is extraordinary and unjustified, which is why it is right for us to try to deal with it."


The pubco model is what the Conservatives were supporting. It's disgraceful angry.gif


You really are selective. Punch Taverns, the company you've rallied against, come into being in 1997, the year Tony Blair became Prime Minister. There was then 13 years of Labour government who did absolutely nothing about it. And Greg Mulholland that you're praising - he's a Lib Dem! He's only an MP at all because he took the seat from Labour!

I'm not just against Punch Taverns, I'm against all pubcos. When it comes to looking after pubs, I don't care which party does it. Well done Greg Mulholland I say.

Why are the Conservatives voting for the pubco system NOW is what beer drinkers everywhere would like to know. Or not bothering to vote at all in the case of the less than useless Stephen Moseley.


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shunter blue
post Nov 28 2014, 03:28 PM
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QUOTE (Neil Fishers Biggest Fan @ Nov 27 2014, 02:48 PM) *
QUOTE (shunter blue @ Nov 27 2014, 12:26 PM) *
QUOTE (3mm @ Nov 20 2014, 02:38 PM) *
The government has been defeated in a Commons vote on the control that parent companies can exercise over pubs. BBC News

Details of the proposals are here: Publicans to get a fairer deal ...... CAMRA's reaction: CAMRA press release ...... HANSARD coverage of the debate.

Aren't the Conservatives supposed to believe in competition, an open market and entrepreneurship? Why on earth would they support pubcos who force landlords to buy beer from them at vastly inflated prices instead of allowing them to go to the open market? Well done the opposition for defeating the government on this one guiness.gif


Votes cast by local MPs:
Andrew Miller (Ellesmere Port/Neston, Lab) - voted Yes
Ian Lucas (Wrexham, Lab) - voted Yes
Mark Tami (Alyn/Deeside, Lab) - voted Yes
Stephen O'Brien (Eddisbury, Con) - voted No
Stephen Moseley (Chester, Con) - no vote registered

Overall result: 284 Yes, 269 No.

Judging by some of your posts on here I can see that you've got the Tories sussed out. It's a pity NFBT is so blind. Horrible party. I always vote, but I'm struggling this time round to vote Labour (over Milliband holding the S*n) but I probably will.

I assume you mean me SB?
First of all SB of course you are going to get approval of left wing" posts,history shows that DC has overwhelmingly left wing posters,and I have no problem with that.
We all have our reasons for voting for who we do,Im certainly not blind! I understand yours,there are many reasons I would never vote Labour,I'm not going to start a debate on here on that,suffice to say,at the moment we have a shadow secretary speaking out about private schooling,and where was he educated? Private school of course,this seems to be a theme that continually runs through the history of the Labour Party,hypocrisy,"don't do what I do,do what I say"
As you say yourself,you are even struggling yourself to decide to vote for Millibland,but of course you will,we even had a Champaign Socialist MP sneering at one of the "so called working class" the other day,that the Labour Party are supposed to represent,so I understand that it may be difficult for to recognise the Party as you once knew it,now we have former PM Multi-millionaire Blair telling Millibland not to pull the party too much to the "left" and to take the middle ground.
If I'm allowed to offer an opinion,the party certainly chose the wrong Millibland brother,and it's a relief that Alan Johnson has not decided to put himself forward as contender for the leadership,David Millibland or Alan Johnson would be way ahead in the polls at the moment,as the present government has had to take some every unpleasant decisions to correct our economy which doesn't go down well with all voters,but let's wait until May and see what happens.

Sorry I cannot read your posts while you continue to ignore the principles of written English.
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Canadian Exile
post Dec 3 2014, 12:25 AM
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QUOTE (shunter blue @ Nov 28 2014, 10:28 AM) *
QUOTE (Neil Fishers Biggest Fan @ Nov 27 2014, 02:48 PM) *
QUOTE (shunter blue @ Nov 27 2014, 12:26 PM) *
QUOTE (3mm @ Nov 20 2014, 02:38 PM) *
The government has been defeated in a Commons vote on the control that parent companies can exercise over pubs. BBC News

Details of the proposals are here: Publicans to get a fairer deal ...... CAMRA's reaction: CAMRA press release ...... HANSARD coverage of the debate.

Aren't the Conservatives supposed to believe in competition, an open market and entrepreneurship? Why on earth would they support pubcos who force landlords to buy beer from them at vastly inflated prices instead of allowing them to go to the open market? Well done the opposition for defeating the government on this one guiness.gif


Votes cast by local MPs:
Andrew Miller (Ellesmere Port/Neston, Lab) - voted Yes
Ian Lucas (Wrexham, Lab) - voted Yes
Mark Tami (Alyn/Deeside, Lab) - voted Yes
Stephen O'Brien (Eddisbury, Con) - voted No
Stephen Moseley (Chester, Con) - no vote registered

Overall result: 284 Yes, 269 No.

Judging by some of your posts on here I can see that you've got the Tories sussed out. It's a pity NFBT is so blind. Horrible party. I always vote, but I'm struggling this time round to vote Labour (over Milliband holding the S*n) but I probably will.

I assume you mean me SB?
First of all SB of course you are going to get approval of left wing" posts,history shows that DC has overwhelmingly left wing posters,and I have no problem with that.
We all have our reasons for voting for who we do,Im certainly not blind! I understand yours,there are many reasons I would never vote Labour,I'm not going to start a debate on here on that,suffice to say,at the moment we have a shadow secretary speaking out about private schooling,and where was he educated? Private school of course,this seems to be a theme that continually runs through the history of the Labour Party,hypocrisy,"don't do what I do,do what I say"
As you say yourself,you are even struggling yourself to decide to vote for Millibland,but of course you will,we even had a Champaign Socialist MP sneering at one of the "so called working class" the other day,that the Labour Party are supposed to represent,so I understand that it may be difficult for to recognise the Party as you once knew it,now we have former PM Multi-millionaire Blair telling Millibland not to pull the party too much to the "left" and to take the middle ground.
If I'm allowed to offer an opinion,the party certainly chose the wrong Millibland brother,and it's a relief that Alan Johnson has not decided to put himself forward as contender for the leadership,David Millibland or Alan Johnson would be way ahead in the polls at the moment,as the present government has had to take some every unpleasant decisions to correct our economy which doesn't go down well with all voters,but let's wait until May and see what happens.

Sorry I cannot read your posts while you continue to ignore the principles of written English.

He was probably educated under a labour goverment. rolleyes.gif


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3mm
post Oct 18 2017, 10:10 AM
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Nearly 3 years on, has much changed between the pubs / pubco's?

I think not.

The Conservatives, many of whom probably own shares in pubco's (why wouldn't they, they make money exploiting people) have swept this one under the carpet.


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